i wrote an article about watchtower-sanctioned shunning for next month's issue of minnesota atheist.
since most of you probably aren't subscribers, you can read it here:.
http://mnatheists.org/.
I wrote an article about Watchtower-sanctioned shunning for next month's issue of Minnesota Atheist. Since most of you probably aren't subscribers, you can read it here:
It's the lead story on MN Atheists' website (for the moment, anyway).
Hope you like it (there's a spot to leave comments following the article).
Badboy:
Here's a breakdown of the rapid evolution that transpired among caterpillars and other animals after the Flood:
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
Scully - good point, at least no one's accusing me of child molestation.
Quandry- Yeah, I've never heard of this before. My wife wants to know what the equivalent is for getting back in the good graces (not that I want to)? If you're DF'd, you're supposed to ask to be reinstated. But if you're removed, do you ask to be...re-installed?
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
LeavingWT-
You posted that as I was posting mine!
Thanks for the link. As you can see from my bio, I do not live in an all-party consent state. I live in Minnesota, as does my friend, and all the elders of my former congregation. All phone conversations took place within state boundaries.
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
Willy,
You make some good points. But, with respect the recorded audio, I already have two phone conversations with this very same elder available on YouTube already. They've been up there for a year and a half and no one's ever told me I need to take them down (from a legal standpoint, that is). The elder's name is removed from the video, so in that way he's anonymized. He has never called me or emailed me to ask me to remove it. The law varies from state to state here in America, and I looked up the law in my homestate prior to posting the conversations.
You're right that JWs misinterpret the language. Even I, after listening to my friend on the phone, thought that I had been DF'd. It was only after listening to it carefully, later, that I realized he had pussyfooted around the term "DF". My sister-in-law, too, swears I am DF'd, claiming that the elder told her so. I pointed out that the elder merely told her I was no longer a JW, which was not a secret in the first place. She, of course, hasn't written back.
If you look at the letter, you'll see that I specifically said it is not a letter of disassociation, and that I saw no reason, legal or scriptural, to officially remove myself from association with the JWs (it's in the last paragraph). You're right, they might have still considered me DA'd, but they really had to wrestle with it, I'm sure.
A lot of people here seem very concerned with me "moving on". Thanks so much for the support. I want to make it clear, however, that I wasn't looking for any help with the hope of hanging on to relationships, or as a means of having closure. I was jsut seeking out advice on how to make the JW elders/Watchtower Society squirm even more. Since it appears a lawsuit is out of the question, that's just fine! I'm not looking for any legal victory or monetary compensation. I was just wondering how to go about making known my story. After all, I was always taught to not let my light hide under a basket.
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
"you do know recording a phone call without both parties knowledge can lead to legal issues, right?"
...WizardCA:
I've looked into this before, and my understanding of the law is that it is legal to record a phone conversation as long as at least one party knows and agrees to it. In this case, my friend is the one who knew and agreed to it.
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
...Great idea, Gary. The nice thing about the convention center is that out-of-towners can ask for the Watchtower discount.
Mary - another great idea. I'll have to flip through my address book & see who's in there.
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
Okay, you all have me convinced to contact the local papers. I'll do that as soon as I have time.
StAnn- That's another good idea. I'll get in touch w/ Silent Lambs. First I need to import the phone conversation into my computer & delete my friend's name. Then I'll contact them and see if they want to use it.
Nathan- You may be right, the lawyer was just looking for $$$. She indicated that, since the elders appeared to have gone against their own rules, and divulged private information to a random guy who called, that my case would be stronger than most. But, don't worry, at that price, I didn't take the bait.
And just for the record, I have moved on with life, and I have a good circle of non-JW friends, including my own sister (my only other family member who's not a JW) and a couple of guys who left years earlier that I reconnected with. My point in posting here was not to try to hang onto friendships with JWs, but to do my part to expose the organization. Actually, if I thought there was a chance in preserving any relationship, I wouldn't be so vocal, because I'd want to maintain that relationship. As I wrote above, my sister-in-law (one of the few JWs who still said hi to us), has recently ceased all association with us. So, apart from very awkward phone calls I get from my dad (about once a month), I pretty much have no contact with any JWs anymore.
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
Mary & Rebel-
That's a great idea. I hadn't considered that. Maybe I'll write something up during my lunch break (it's either that or go have lunch with my worldly co-workers!).
Calling the elder is a good idea, too, but I fear I'd be way too nervous to do that. As you can tell from my phone conversations (see links above), I am a nervous wreck when dealing with confronations.
AAG-
Wow, the same thing happened to you, too? I guess I'm not unique. As I said above, they seem to really feel like they need to silence those who formerly had 'privileges'.
Yeah, I'm happy with the freedom, too. For a long time, I curttailed how vocal I was about the WT's hypocrisy. But, now, since everyone shuns me anyways, I've decided to become a first-class apostate.
as many of you already know, my wife and i left the jws simply because we discovered it was not true.
we did not commit any sins, and we did not sow seeds of doubt in the congregation.
in fact, at the last meeting my wife attended, she still fully believed it was the truth.. .
Jeff-
Yeah, I vaguely recall reading that back when I was a JW. It's a good point, though.
It seems, then, that if you want to "successfully" fade, you must:
1) Be very quiet about what you've discovered.
and
2) Not have any superfine relatives that feel it's their mission from Jehovah to punish you.
I suppose it also helps if you weren't that popular of a JW in the first place. In my case, everyone noticed as soon as I was gone.
